We were cruising the archives the other day and noticed that the last time we (and by "we," I mean LE) did a Magic Number post was more than two years ago. Some commenters have been screaming for an update, and we've taken the position that in this economy the numbers really matter very little - if you are a first year associate in Las Vegas, you should really take what you can get. While trying to get ourselves hyped-up to send out another survey (that would go largely ignored), it hit us: wouldn't it be easier just to post the old list and ask for updates? Lazy blogging, FTW.
So, here, ranked in order by highest (or best) "magic number" are the Vegas firms salaries as they stood back in July of 2008. For more information about LE's "Magic Number" methodology, look here.
So, here, ranked in order by highest (or best) "magic number" are the Vegas firms salaries as they stood back in July of 2008. For more information about LE's "Magic Number" methodology, look here.
Name $ per billable (Salary/Min Billable)
Watt, Tieder 73 ($145,000/2000 billables)
DLA Piper 72.5 ($145,000/2000 billables)
Duane Morris 69 ($135,000/1950 billables)
Ballard Spahr 68 ($133,000/1950 billables)
Fox Rothschild 68 ($125,000/1850 billables)
Snell & Wilmer 67 ($120,000/1800 billables) -- [only 1800 billables for 1st yr]
Fennemore Craig 65 ($125,000/1925 billables)
Payne & Fears 64 ($125,000/1950 billables)
Lewis & Roca 63 ($120,000/1900 billables)
Hale Lane 63 ($120,000/1900 billables)-- [incl. 100 required pro bono hrs--67 if excl. pro bono]
Lionel Sawyer 61 ($110,000/1800 billables)
Snell & Wilmer [2] 60 ($120,000/2000 billables)-- [2000 billables after 1st yr]
Greenberg Traurig 59 ($112,000/1900 billables)
Jennings, Strouss 58 ($110,000/1900 billables)
Bullivant Hauser 57 ($105,000/1850 billables)
Downey Brand 57 ($100,000/1750 billables)
Brownstein Hyatt 56 ($110,000/1950 billables)
Jones Vargas 55 ($102,000/1850 billables)
Fisher & Phillips 54 ($100,000/1850 billables)
McDonald Carano Wilson 54 ($100,000/1850 billables)
Santoro, Driggs 53 ($95,000/1800 billables)
Gordon & Silver 53 ($95,000/1800 billables)
Kummer Kaempfer 53 ($100,000/1900 billables)
Morris Pickering 51 ($95,000/1850 billables)
Marquis & Aurbach 50 ($100,000/2000 billables)
McCormick Barstow 46 ($80,000/1750)
Hutchison & Steffen 45 ($86,000/1900 billables)
Lewis Brisbois 43 ($84,000/1950 billables)
Alverson, Taylor 43 ($78,800/1840 billables)
Thorndal, Armstrong 31 ($68,000/2160 billables)
Other--not enough info for magic number:
Jennings, Strouss 58 ($110,000/1900 billables)
Bullivant Hauser 57 ($105,000/1850 billables)
Downey Brand 57 ($100,000/1750 billables)
Brownstein Hyatt 56 ($110,000/1950 billables)
Jones Vargas 55 ($102,000/1850 billables)
Fisher & Phillips 54 ($100,000/1850 billables)
McDonald Carano Wilson 54 ($100,000/1850 billables)
Santoro, Driggs 53 ($95,000/1800 billables)
Gordon & Silver 53 ($95,000/1800 billables)
Kummer Kaempfer 53 ($100,000/1900 billables)
Morris Pickering 51 ($95,000/1850 billables)
Marquis & Aurbach 50 ($100,000/2000 billables)
McCormick Barstow 46 ($80,000/1750)
Hutchison & Steffen 45 ($86,000/1900 billables)
Lewis Brisbois 43 ($84,000/1950 billables)
Alverson, Taylor 43 ($78,800/1840 billables)
Thorndal, Armstrong 31 ($68,000/2160 billables)
Other--not enough info for magic number:
So there you have it. If you work for one of these firms and have updated info, please let us know in the comments. We are also interested in information regarding compensation for some of the larger plaintiffs shops.
My oh my, how time flies. Per the LVRJ, firms can't even afford insurance anymore.
ReplyDeleteAt 15% "official" unemployment, any attorney with any income at all should be happy.
I'm happy to have a job. I'm happy to make six figures. And, I'd be happy to make more money.
ReplyDeleteBallard Spahr $115,000
Snell & Wilmer $105,000
Fox Rothschild - $115,000
Fennemore Craig - screwy 2 track pay system based on 1800 or 2000 hours: around $105,000
Payne & Fears $125,000
Lewis & Roca $110,000
Holland & Hart $110,000
Jones Vargas $102,000
Morris Peterson $100,000
Kolesar Leatham $97,500
Gordon & Silver $95,000
Santoro Driggs $95,000
Hutchison & Steffen - as low as they can get away with.
ATMS $80,400
Those are pretty accurate.
DLA Piper shouldn't be included - it has 1 "of counsel" attorney in Las Vegas. I hear Glaser Weil starts close to $140, but I can't confirm.
Lewis Brisbois started at $87,500.00 in 2009... but should probably be in the same category as "as low as they can get away with."
ReplyDeleteI work at Hutchison & Steffen. The hate you guys spew at us is aweful. We start our associates at 115k with great benefits. Don't let anyone else tell you otherwise.
ReplyDeleteI work at ATMS. The hate you guys spew at us is also aweful. We start our associates at $160k. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
ReplyDeleteExcellent.
ReplyDeleteStealst.
ReplyDeleteMakes me want to go back to a firm, oh wait, I just threw up in my mouth a little.
ReplyDeleteMake money wacking traffic tickets.
ReplyDeleteYou can wack in the morning,
you can wack after noon
You can wack and make millions
start wacking real soon.
@12:23 - You are a liar. The highest paid associate at H&S barely gets paid $115k. Although, I do agree with you on the point that the hate that is spewed at H&S is not justified.
ReplyDeleteWait, I thought it was Hutchinson & Steffen...
ReplyDelete@12:23. I actually work at H&S. 115K is not starting. If the 7 newly hired associates started at 115, I am quitting...
ReplyDeleteHey Guise!
ReplyDeleteI work at H&S, and our spelling is aweful. Don't let anyone other than @12:23 tell you otherwise.
We tried to hire an illegal for proofreading, as to reduce overhead because associates only get one new Benz, while Partners each get 2...
Sadly, the new prospect was netted prior to making it over the AZ state line, just after he made it over the US border. We would've started him at 1.15k, plus full retainer credit for our immigration services. He's the Juan that got away...
This post and thread just reinforces how happy I am working my ass to the bone for MYSELF. NO way NO how I will ever answer to anyone ever again. I don't care how bad the economy gets.
ReplyDeleteTroy Fox starts his associates at 115K with great benefits. Don't let anyone tell you different.
ReplyDeleteThe hate you guys spew at Troy Fox is aweful [sic].
ReplyDeleteI want to have Troy Fox's baby.
ReplyDelete@12:24,
ReplyDeleteSure, that's what they start you at. But then the partner suddenly realizes that all the crap he required you to work on for the last 6 months, to the exclusion of all other matters, isn't necessary for the client after all, and *poof* goes your salary for the next 6 months.
I think you can knock some dollars off of most of these and add a few extra billable hours. That was then, this is now. Part of the problem with the Nevada lawyer economy was the big national firms coming in and over-paying useless new associates and then laying them off when they realized the market can't support it.
ReplyDeleteI think part of the problem is that Troy Fox is such an awesome guy to work for that it makes some people jealous. Excellent pay, good benefits, a chicken in every pot if you will, and he doesn't care about billable hours.
ReplyDeleteHas anyone heard what's going on at Jones Vargas? They space they rent in Reno (12 floor and all or part of the 11th floor of the Museum Tower) is being actively marketed.
ReplyDelete9:45 p.m. - You are on the money. The market here didn't justify the national firm payscales, but they market themselves to law students nationally and took the cowardly way out. The ATMS model is not the solution either, however.
ReplyDeleteSimple economics:
ReplyDelete1st to 3rd year associate:
Big Firm (work long hours - $100,000 to $110,000 is fair
Small firm (work short hours -
$70,000 to $80,000 is fair
Any more than the above, the business model doesn't work unless the billable hours are higher or the associate brings new business in. Otherwise, higher pay = more pressure to bill = layoffs if not enough work to bill.
@5:31 I love you
ReplyDelete@5:57 thanks for validating my small firm!
ReplyDeleteCartoon from RJ pretty good!
ReplyDeleteShould I feel bad that I don't work for one of the firms listed on the thread?
ReplyDeleteNo, you should list your firm and how much it pays.
ReplyDelete@10:19 -- Jones Vargas in Reno is moving to the old Harrah's building by the baseball park.
ReplyDeleteI would update that list for H&S to say $75,000 and 1900 hours. That's probably pretty accurate from what I've heard from new associates starting there.
ReplyDeletean attorney at Helm and Associates offered me $65,000 and 2400 hours per month. not many other female attorneys, so i looked elsewhere.
ReplyDeleteAt Holland & Hart the billable requirement is 1800 and 100 hours pro bono. 1st years start at $110k.
ReplyDeleteOh wait, don't forget Kravitz, Schnitzer, Sloane, Johnson and Eberhardy--1800 billabl/ 6k...with bogus promises of bonuses that are impossible to get given their bonus structure and the fact that they bill out their associates at bargain rates to be able to compete with better firms.
ReplyDeleteUm, can you say, cheap?
60k, not 6k. correction.
ReplyDelete